Ohio State faces failure to monitor charge
"In a signal that tougher penalties likely loom, the NCAA has notified Ohio State University that it is facing a charge of failing to monitor its violation-plagued football program.
Failure to monitor is the second-worst finding the NCAA can impose on an athletic program.
Ohio State announced the NCAA findings this afternoon and that it would cut five scholarships over a three-year period beginning next year. The NCAA allows football programs to have 85 scholarship players.
A spokesman for Ohio State athletics said the self-imposed punishment would not mean the Buckeyes would pare back to 80 scholarships over the next three years. He said that the team might not use, say, two of the 85 in 2012, one in 2013 and two in 2014, for a total of five over the period.
The NCAA previously had notified OSU that it was not being accused of failure to monitor or the worst charge — loss of institutional control. The NCAA’s move to invoke the charge now means that the NCAA considers the violations committed by Ohio State to stem from a central problem, rather than individual misdeed."
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Does anybody believe that tOSU’s scholarship cut response is going to be deemed adequate?
"Bama Hawkeye, you know, the Iowa blogger who actually uses reason and analysis." - Patrick Vint
http://www.offtackleempire.com
I could see the NCAA
making it 10 scholarships over 3 years, but at this point, I don’t see any bowl bans on the horizon.
Second worst NCAA charge possible
Cut 1.66 scholarships per year for three years
I’m sure that will satisfy them!………
Angelo: Right….so anyways Jay, I’m sure you understand that we needed to make this move and I wanna wish you the best of luck.
Cutler: (Swoops bangs out of eyes by throwing his head back) Whatever, I don’t need this team or you.
/Leaves in a huff
//Writes bad poetry on his blog
Grossman: What the fuck is Wilford Brimley’s problem?
by Packers3485 on Nov 10, 2011 4:08 PM CST up reply actions 1 recs
as with before, probably an initial attempt at swaying the NCAA. They might tack on a few more scholarships, say (9 total over 3 years?). The improper benefits were to nine players. Granted they all served suspensions already, but combined with the previous charges, I can see the NCAA upping the ante a little. Although I don’t foresee a bowl ban at this point.
So for tat-gate and payment fiasco, OSU has self imposed 2 years probabtion and 5 scholarships. I can see the NCAA upping that to 3 years and 9 scholarships. But that is strictly a guess.
It will be a LOT more than that.
The NCAA tends to go for a 2-for-1 penalty where such a thing can be done (see Michigan’s excess-practice-time case). Nine ineligible players, with Tressel having clearly known about some of them (possibly all) and by comparison with USC losing 30 scholarships for one player (albeit significantly higher amounts of money)? I don’t think there’s any chance they get off with less than 15 scholarships and a one-year bowl ban, and I would be a bit surprised if the latter isn’t two years (the ineligible players had their suspensions pushed back to after the bowl game before we had any idea just how deep the rabbit hole went there; I can definitely see the NCAA swinging a bigger hammer because of that).
I've got this terrible pain in all the diodes down my left-hand side.
Bradley-Terry rankings for college football and basketball: because there aren't enough computer rankings already.
Where in the hell do you get your facts?
Do some homework before you make such a silly statement. Wow!
It’s not an ironclad fact, but it’s been used enough that 2-for-1 is a decent measure to go by. For example, Michigan’s penalty included 2-for1 cuts in allowable practice time based on how much they went over in their recent investigation.
I do think Dan may have overstated the likely penalties for OSU, but I can at least see the reasoning he is using for his guess.
I do think the NCAA will come down harder than they ordinarily would
because of OSU attempting to stonewall them at every turn and basically being made a fool of when they allowed the suspensions to be deferred when it turned out that Tressel knew about at least some of the violations well in advance. They really do not like being obstructed; it’s part of what got USC as much as they did and part of what got Georgia Tech to get hammered surprisingly hard for what seemed like a pretty minor thing in comparison. The Tat 5 having their suspensions delayed to allow them to play in the Sugar Bowl is, IMO, what makes at least a one-year bowl ban a near certainty.
I don’t have any inside sources here; I’m speculating based on what I’ve seen in other recent cases. But there is absolutely no chance that the COI is going to let it be at 2 years probation and 5 scholarships. That’s not much more than Michigan gave themselves for an extra half hour of stretching a week and an idiot in the compliance department who decided that doing the necessary paperwork was a waste of time.
I've got this terrible pain in all the diodes down my left-hand side.
Bradley-Terry rankings for college football and basketball: because there aren't enough computer rankings already.
Stonewall?
You must be kidding! The violations were SELF-REPORTED. They have been extremely forthcoming with everything! Have you not heard of Tenn, Tsun? Do you even know how many violations they had without the doom and gloom you predict? That is the homework that needs to be done.
by biggy84 on Nov 10, 2011 11:17 PM CST up reply actions 1 recs
Self-reported AFTER word got out to the media.
And “forthcoming” is about the opposite of how I would describe any place that is fighting a number of FOIA requests.
I've got this terrible pain in all the diodes down my left-hand side.
Bradley-Terry rankings for college football and basketball: because there aren't enough computer rankings already.
Ridiculous!
No sense in talking about it with you. All was self-reported. The requests pertained to espin, NOT the ncaa.
I think in your avatar,
Calvin must be peeing on your sense of logic, or perhaps onto your scarlet & grey glasses.
It is fact that tOSU program (read: Tressel) was aware of accusations, buried them during the season, and kept player it knew would be ineligible on the field.
It is also a known fact that self-reporting only happened once this shit storm hit the national media, and tOSU had no choice but to “investigate.”
Like others are attempting to remind you, the problem here isn’t just the original violations, rather, it’s the cover-up, and that is what will lead to further punishment. In a way, very similar to perjury in court.
However, you do win this week’s Internet prize for biggest delusional homer. Congrats!
His facts are way off!
The big one is that UCS had one player! Usc had multiple players in multiple sports. Usc had 35, count them, 35 violations including LOIC. TOSU isn’t even in the same ballpark!
Tressel knowing of 9 players is also completely false. The ineligible players were already punished,and their case is closed (hence the suspensions this year). Without knowing what rules were broken, the number involved, the speculation of rabbit hole, that is what i base it on.
I just went back to reread the USC report.
One football player (the penalties were increased some by the LOIC finding, however), one basketball player, and one former women’s tennis player. Seven headings in the report (some of which do constitute multiple instances of improper benefits, but that’s almost certain to apply to Ohio State as well). Even the original Tat 5 alone would account for twice as many active players as at USC, albeit on a smaller scale.
I've got this terrible pain in all the diodes down my left-hand side.
Bradley-Terry rankings for college football and basketball: because there aren't enough computer rankings already.
35 violations!
No matter how you want to slice it. And, 3 sports. Getting back to your original false claim of one….
by biggy84 on Nov 11, 2011 12:35 AM CST up reply actions 2 recs
Not to mention..
tOSU has already learned of their violations. There aren’t any double-secret phantom charges. Compare the violations of Tenn and Tsun.
by biggy84 on Nov 11, 2011 12:38 AM CST up reply actions 2 recs
I honestly don’t know this answer, so I am asking for clarification.
Most of the other penalties that were enforced that I think you are referring to, happened after the fact, ie the players were gone, so the punishment could not be meted out to them individualy, and therefore the 2 for 1 makes a lot of sense.
However, in this case, the players were suspended, and pretty much in line with what other players in other instances were suspended based on the dollar amounts.
So why in this case would OSU get hammered twice?
Mostly on the cover-up.
I may be overestimating, but if there’s one bit of consistency in the way the COI has handled things lately, it’s this: you do not want to hide anything. USC basically dared them to do something and got the harshest penalty since the last time they handed down a TV ban (and came damn close to getting one of those themselves). That OkSt WR a few years back (not Blackmon, they had somebody else who was really good) who had met with Deion Sanders and lied because he was worried that it was a violation got a full year suspension for it, and the meeting he lied about didn’t violate any rules in itself. Georgia Tech got hammered for relatively minor benefits for the NCAA equivalent of witness tampering.
If you find out about impermissible benefits, suspend the player, forward the info to the NCAA and wait for them to be cleared, that’s usually the end of it. Tressel knew or should have known for months before they did anything; if that happens there are almost always severe sanctions.
I've got this terrible pain in all the diodes down my left-hand side.
Bradley-Terry rankings for college football and basketball: because there aren't enough computer rankings already.
I understand where you are coming from, but the “cover-up” in this instance is only for the tat-gate, not the charity $$. In fact, the “cover-up” was pretty much limited to Tressel himself, not the university.
So lets agree to disagree on what OSU did strictly for the tat-gate.
Can you agree that for the charity $$ the players got suspeneded (even a bit harshly) and that normally would have been the end of the situation? But since OSU had places itself on probation already, when they got news of the impermissable benefits, they notified the NCAA and suspended the players.They are also now adding scholarship reductions because of this immpropriety while on probabtion, when normally that would not have been the case.
I just think you are overreaching somewhat.
I think that if anything, OSU might have gotten a few scholarship reductions added in for the initial self imposed penalties anyways, so the 5 may not be enough. But I think the bowl ban itself is out of play here. Just my opinion.
That's the one.
Thanks.
I've got this terrible pain in all the diodes down my left-hand side.
Bradley-Terry rankings for college football and basketball: because there aren't enough computer rankings already.
also, don’t forget that the NCAA will take into account Tressel being let go. In the USC case, Carroll stuck around. So this is more of an apple to orange comparison.
Carroll was gone by the time the verdict was handed down.
And every single coach who has ever been hit with the charges Tressel got (lying to the NCAA regarding potential violations) has gotten a show-cause. Tressel was gone the moment the report got out; waiting six months to fire him (after suspending him for two games, for what has historically been a “you don’t coach in college anymore, period” offense) isn’t going to help their argument.
I've got this terrible pain in all the diodes down my left-hand side.
Bradley-Terry rankings for college football and basketball: because there aren't enough computer rankings already.
While the offenses are microscopic in this shit storm of a week
The NCAA will ultimately deem these self-imposed reduction of scholarships as inadequate.
I'll take whatever the NCAA deems necessary
If it means that someone finally pulls the trigger on Gene Smith. He didn’t even try to go to bat for Posey and there was an argument to be made in the kid’s last violation.
And, seconded. What a horrible, terrible week. I was going to make a modest joke about Minnesota’s game this weekend with Wisconsin, but given Bielema’s already horribly mistimed statements, I will just go with, “Let’s be careful out there.”
And may the Badgers pay back all the mistakes the Gophers have made in their favor and surrender the Axe this weekend
Amen.
When we get the Pig, the Jug and the Axe, we'll have one hell of a picnic
by Marshmoose on Nov 10, 2011 4:55 PM CST up reply actions 1 recs
They're horribly mistimed...
if taken completely out of context, which is just about what EVERY site I’ve seen running those lines have done.
What I heard from Bielema: "You know, obviously I wasn’t well-versed in the situation, but JoePa has done a lot for the game, done a lot for the world of college football, and, a guy that, uh, you can’t take anything away that he’s done from a football standpoint. All that other stuff, I’ll let other people make decisions on. I think the NCAA is pretty clear on NCAA vs. well, obviously the other things around Coach Sandusky, and all that are legal matters and I can’t see football or NCAA getting involved in something like that, but, you know, I definitely think that it just brings a little cloud to the world of college football. That’s the only thing that I was upset. […] Who in their mind would have thought that three major teams in our conference, Ohio State, Michigan, and Penn State would have these issues? But I guess, enjoy and embrace being a Badger fan."
Author at Acme Packing Company, a Green Bay Packers blog, and Editor at BT Powerhouse, a Big Ten Basketball blog
#FireCraigJames
Follow @GSchofield50
by OBrienSchofieldismyHero on Nov 10, 2011 6:43 PM CST up reply actions
As a Badger fan I'm disgusted by his comments
I hope he will learn to hold his tongue. Oh, and game management.
Bielema is a fat turd version of Rex Ryan.
by Revenge of the Fallen on Nov 10, 2011 7:11 PM CST up reply actions
Hang on now...
You’re saying Rex Ryan is skinny?
by Midnight Rambler on Nov 10, 2011 7:59 PM CST up reply actions
Speaking of Ryan family members,
And in keeping with the spirit of this week’s power poll – am I not the only one who thinks Rob Ryan looks like a big version of The Dude?
by MSUDersh on Nov 10, 2011 8:53 PM CST via mobile up reply actions
Definitely.
The resemblance is truly striking.
Author at Acme Packing Company, a Green Bay Packers blog, and Editor at BT Powerhouse, a Big Ten Basketball blog
#FireCraigJames
Follow @GSchofield50
by OBrienSchofieldismyHero on Nov 10, 2011 8:55 PM CST up reply actions
I thought to myself this morning
“Man, if you’ve got something you’ve been waiting to drop, now is the time to do it.”
Executive Producer - WRNL TV
Oregon already did...
They dropped their latest report about the will lyles mess this week.
by GoAUpher on Nov 10, 2011 4:43 PM CST via mobile up reply actions
So why hasn't Craig James come clean yet?
He’s facing some pretty serious allegations. But that’s all they are. Allegations.
Author at Acme Packing Company, a Green Bay Packers blog, and Editor at BT Powerhouse, a Big Ten Basketball blog
#FireCraigJames
Follow @GSchofield50
by OBrienSchofieldismyHero on Nov 10, 2011 5:56 PM CST up reply actions
The pimps saw the murders but didn't call the cops allegedly
They called their mommies instead.
And so we have an alleged murderer working a job on National TV.
Well, that’s just fantastic.
Author at Acme Packing Company, a Green Bay Packers blog, and Editor at BT Powerhouse, a Big Ten Basketball blog
#FireCraigJames
Follow @GSchofield50
by OBrienSchofieldismyHero on Nov 10, 2011 6:07 PM CST up reply actions
Is he the one that killed 5 hookers?
Allegedly?
by clay-born to party on Nov 10, 2011 8:39 PM CST up reply actions
Allegedly, yes.
to the best of my knowledge, he has never denied such accusations.
Author at Acme Packing Company, a Green Bay Packers blog, and Editor at BT Powerhouse, a Big Ten Basketball blog
#FireCraigJames
Follow @GSchofield50
by OBrienSchofieldismyHero on Nov 10, 2011 8:54 PM CST up reply actions 1 recs
LOL... we have to start adding that line. Put it in the passive voice: "To date, the allegations have not been denied."
by WarBuck46410 on Nov 10, 2011 9:37 PM CST up reply actions 4 recs
if you can't beat the media/mob, join it and do as they do. LOL
by WarBuck46410 on Nov 10, 2011 10:39 PM CST up reply actions
Frankly, what the hell is he hiding?
by clay-born to party on Nov 10, 2011 10:42 PM CST up reply actions
It's a typical ESPN cover up
They kill any story that might make them look bad.
Why else
would an organization so tactlessly fend of allegations of murder, while allowing incredibly juvenile gameday posters that end up disgracing the censors?
Author at Acme Packing Company, a Green Bay Packers blog, and Editor at BT Powerhouse, a Big Ten Basketball blog
#FireCraigJames
Follow @GSchofield50
by OBrienSchofieldismyHero on Nov 11, 2011 11:03 AM CST up reply actions
There is every reason to believe
that Craig James murdered 5 hookers during his days at SMU, but it would be slanderous to publish such accusations. Namely, that Craig James actually murdered 5 hookers at SMU.
However, Craig James complicates matters as he has never denied the allegations to date.
Author at Acme Packing Company, a Green Bay Packers blog, and Editor at BT Powerhouse, a Big Ten Basketball blog
#FireCraigJames
Follow @GSchofield50
by OBrienSchofieldismyHero on Nov 10, 2011 11:16 PM CST up reply actions 3 recs
Just to be clear
This charge is unrelated to Tressel, tattoos and merchandise. This is for the booster that paid players for a charity event and allegedly overpaid players for jobs (he denies this charge).
OSU goes in front of the COI on 12/10 for this charge although they are trying to do it by phone the week before the CCG.
Apparently not
Perhaps they don’t want to risk winning the B10 CG and then getting a bowl ban since it would hurt the conference. I haven’t seen an explanation for it, just the statement that they are trying to do it earlier.
The findings likely wouldn't come in until February anyway.
The COI doesn’t hand out punishments the same day they meet with the school in question.
I've got this terrible pain in all the diodes down my left-hand side.
Bradley-Terry rankings for college football and basketball: because there aren't enough computer rankings already.
It’s only the way it worked with every other program that’s gone in front of the COI in recent memory. OSU is still waiting on judgement from their meeting in August.
But keep throwing out your FACTS argument.
From following four separate cases in recent memory.
If I didn’t already know you were clueless as to how these things work, the fact that you didn’t know that two months from COI meeting to the final findings is a fairly standard timeline would have been a dead giveaway.
I've got this terrible pain in all the diodes down my left-hand side.
Bradley-Terry rankings for college football and basketball: because there aren't enough computer rankings already.
Don't hide when you are wrong!
You very cluelessly don’t understand that they already had a meeting Aug 12th of this year. You must not have a clue that this is an addendum to what was already heard. If you had done research, you would have found that tOSU has already answered and plead guilty to the added charges.
Wow you are so wrong
“School officials are scheduled to appear before the NCAA infractions committee again on Dec. 10 to answer to these latest charges. However, Ohio State has asked to have the charges reviewed during a conference call the week of Nov. 28 — the final week of the football regular season.”
by clay-born to party on Nov 10, 2011 11:13 PM CST up reply actions
Did you even read the comment I was replying to?
I've got this terrible pain in all the diodes down my left-hand side.
Bradley-Terry rankings for college football and basketball: because there aren't enough computer rankings already.
Having ridden this particular merry-go-round
numerous times earlier this summer, I’ll save you the time and frustration with this simple warning: This is no point in debating with biggy. He has absolutely no interest in clarifying the matter, he only wants to deflect, distract and throw up a bunch of red herrings. He’ll demand “facts” when you are clearly, and explicitly, stating an opinion; your rationale can never be “right” when it diverges from his own. He will also willfully and deliberately misrepresent those facts that do exist — see his repeated attempts to claim that OSU did not admit to being a repeat offender under the NCAA bylaws — when they are inconvenient for him. His sole intent is to make you spend all your time arguing trivialities and irrelevancies so that you don’t focus on the key issue at play. Namely, that things just got a lot worse for OSU.
I ate the blue ones ... they taste like burning.
Or try and inform you.
You don’t and won’t get it. But then again, you predicted fucksawed. How accurate was that? Deflecting is your version of disagreeing with the facts.
no specific response
grew up in Davenport IA; undergrad Iowa State; law school U of iowa; Iowa football season ticket holder since 1977
this week in the B10 is the story arc of Deadwood of Al Swearengen passing the kidney stone
Private Joker, he's silly and he's ignorant, but he's got guts and guts is enough. Now you ladies carry on!
Man I loved Deadwood
There was something Shakespearean about the story lines. Common, bawdy, deep, and often quirky humorous. And it takes place in the old west. Great show.
Bettendorf is infinitely better than that shit hole Davenport.
Why else is almost the whole word “better” in our city?
by clay-born to party on Nov 10, 2011 10:37 PM CST up reply actions
No scholarship reductions at Penn State
and they’ll be able to play in bowl games, too. anybody else think the NCAA’s priority’s are misplaced over less than $2000?
No, not really.
The NCAA’s job is to provide a level playing field for intercollegiate athletics. The shit in Happy Valley is a matter for law enforcement and did not provide any advantage on the playing field. (It’s certainly the least of my concerns at the moment, but I’d imagine between the scandal itself and the turnover in coaching, PSU football is going to be hard hit without any help from the NCAA.)
I've got this terrible pain in all the diodes down my left-hand side.
Bradley-Terry rankings for college football and basketball: because there aren't enough computer rankings already.
by SpartanDan on Nov 10, 2011 10:49 PM CST up reply actions 3 recs
PSU is going to be WRECKED
i dont know who will do the wrecking, but someone is going to hit PSU with something. thats a forgone conclusion. the NCAA wont have to do anything. at the very least the lawsuits from the victims will really really REALLY hurt.
"Your spelling and grammar errors belie a seriously skilled thought process"- therealCatnuts
by justsomehawkeyefan on Nov 11, 2011 1:30 AM CST up reply actions
This is going to be a hit to the University like we have never seen
I can’t imagine a scenario where this isn’t a bloodbath to PSU. From the lawsuits to the potential, and probable, penalties to the University, this will be a very big deal. Add to that the hit to prestige, potential hit to student recruiting (parents who are mad, legacies who are mad, etc), and you have yourself a mess that makes the football connection meaningless. You have the Dept of Education angry on top of that. So yeah, I don’t think the NCAA probably feels it even needs to pile on because honestly, the only part that seems to be innocent is the football players and coaches who didn’t know what was going on.
Always check the words with the red squiggly line. They mean you probably screwed up.
Author @ Off Tackle Empire
by KennardHusker on Nov 11, 2011 9:21 AM CST up reply actions
yes, I agree that the NCAA's priorities are misplaces over less than $2000.
However, the NCAA has no relevance to the Sandusky scandal, no jurisdiction, no ability to fix the situation. The NCAA is a plumber fixing a clogged drain and that catastrophe in State College is a general trying to stop an invasion of lazer-beam shooting aliens. Neither has any relevance to or usefulness for the other.
What does this have to do with Joe Paterno?!
Ever Grateful. Ever True.
by PurdueMatt on Nov 11, 2011 7:04 AM CST reply actions 2 recs
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