B1G 2011 // Purdue Cocktail Party Preview: Is A Bowl Game Out of the Question?
by Graham Filler on Apr 25, 2011 12:14 AM CDT
in Purdue
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PrintTHE PURDUE COCKTAIL PARTY PREVIEW
Purdue at a glance...
First Season: 1887
Head Coach: Danny Hope (3rd Year, 9-15)
All-Time Record: 579--502-48 (.534)
2010 Record: 4-8 (2-6 Conference)
If there was a movie trailer about the 2010 year in West Lafayette, the tagline would have been:
ACL's...will die.
We all knew Purdue was rebuilding with Rob Marve and a really young defense, but we didn't know that Iowa Running Back Hating God would turn simply into Purdue ACL Hating God. Here's an exhaustive football injury list from H&R:
Football: Ralph Bolden, Robert Marve, Justin Siller, Jonathan Linkenheimer, Keith Smith, Keith Carlos, Dan Dierking, Mike Eargle, Kevin Pamphile, Rob Henry, Al-Terek McBurse, Cortez Smith, and O.J. Ross - All suffered injuries that cost them at least one full game. Bolden, Marve, Siller, Linkenheimer, and Ross were lost for the season with theirs. All of these players were starters or expected starters, even Linkenheimer as a kickoff specialist.
...
Two crazy, and not so positive points about 2010.
1) The schedule was relatively cake. Michigan, Indiana, and a struggling MSU team...all should have been beaten by the Boilers. PU failed to take advantage.
2) Here at OTE, we're pretty kind to rebuilding programs or injury-plagued teams. But when teams with those aforementioned characteristics start building bad gameplans or falling apart on defense for no reason, we're less kind. Purdue...was toeing that line in 2010.
[Conversation Pointer: If you want to get someone fired up, mention Purdue's loss to Indiana in 2010, a game that galvanized many in the Purdue community to call for Danny Hope's head...and led to comments like this:
Folks, it doesn't get worse than this. All of the positive momentum of the Joe Tiller Era, let alone last season, is now gone. We are back in the Colletto Era of football, with very little hope for the future.
That's when you know it's been a tough year.]
Should Boilermaker fans expect 8 win seasons? Or should there be some realism here, knowing Purdue has less resources and coaching staff cohesion than most Big Ten teams, and accepting the limitations of that kind of program?
Are the complaints against Danny Hope (not serious enough about his job, overwhelmed by being a D1 coach, unable to focus his team on basics) valid...or can we just blame injuries for 2010's struggles?
Should Hope be canned if the Boilers don't make it to a bowl game this year? (Great H&R quote.."It is understating the obvious when you say that the 2011 season is huge for these guys. If Indiana is firing coaches after three years for lack of performance then Purdue, a program that has been above them for nearly 15 years now, will likely be held to a similar standard. The college football world is too competitive and there are too many bowls to have anything longer than a three year drought.")
Can Rob Henry, most likely your starting quarterback in 2011, get the ball to his big wide receivers?
With Kerrigan gone, what steps will the defensive coaches take to put pressure on quarterbacks?
Why, oh God why, are the special teams so consistently bad?
In the cupboard...
Total returning starters: 18 (7 Offense, 9 Defense, 2 Special Teams)
The defense will be a strength, no question. Linebackers and cornerbacks will be manned by capable veterans like Ricardo Allen, Joe Holland, Josh Johnson, and Kawann Short. Is the talent level still mid-level? Yes, but hard working vets can overcome talent deficiencies.
The offense lacked an identity in 2009 and 2010. Ever since the base concept of Basketball on Grass ("Spread 'em, complete short to medium length passes efficiently") has been lost, the Boilermakers have been searching. Injuries last year forced the Boilers to run a simplified high school-esque run attack at times...and God knows that's prone to break down. Rob Henry's maturation in the pocket is the most important aspect, especially because this team does not have the horses to be a power running unit.
Two final points, to complete your immersion for the day.
1) Keith Smith will not be playing in 2011. You might remember Smith as the 100 catch wide receiver who terrorized everyone in 2009. His sixth year of eligibility was denied. Not only will his hands and ability to get open be missed, but he was a great teammate and teacher for the younger receivers.
2) There is always a spark, or a twist of luck, or some happening that propels a team from the depths of despair to a bowl eligible team. One must ask - What will that spark be? Will Carson Wiggs bang through a 60 yarder to beat Notre Dame, throwing the Irish into fits and pushing PU into the national spotlight? Will one of the explosive cornerbacks take a MarQueis Gray wobbler to the house, sealing the early season must-win against Minnesota?
2011 Schedule:
| Date | Opponent |
| 09/03/11 | vs. MTSU |
| 09/10/11 | @ Rice |
| 09/17/11 | vs. SMSU |
| 10/01/11 | vs. ND |
| 10/08/11 | vs. Minnesota |
| 10/15/11 | @ PSU |
| 10/22/11 | vs. Illinois |
| 10/29/11 | @ Michigan |
| 11/05/11 | @ Wisconsin |
| 11/12/11 | vs. Ohio State |
| 11/19/11 | vs. Iowa |
| 11/26/11 | @ Indiana |
| 12/03/11 | Big Ten Championship |
[Conversation Pointer: Cake, Cake, Cake, Cake...]
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This week... |
|
MONDAY | Purdue Cocktail Party Preview |
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TUESDAY | Point/Counterpoint |
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WEDNESDAY | 4th and 3 |
|
THURSDAY | OTE Potluck |
|
FRIDAY | Keeping the Enemy Close - Rival Blogger Interview |
126 comments
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Comments
I still maintain
The loss to IU was the cherry on top of the Shit Sundae that was our season.
At least we won at Northwestern when they were ranked.
A futile crusade to prevent mass ignorance
HammerAndRails, SBNation's Boilermaker Blog
Game? What game?
All I know is there was a really nice fireworks show that night. Football may or may not have preceded it.
Why?
Was the game held in 1992?
I ate the blue ones ... they taste like burning.
by HoyaGoon on Apr 25, 2011 6:40 PM CDT via mobile up reply actions 3 recs
They didn't have games in 1992...
They told me on my tour that Northwestern first got a football team in 1995.
What, you’re saying that’s wrong?
This will be a big year for us.
It has to be. There is more raw talent on campus than we’ve had in a long, long time. We’ve had some coaching changeovers which will be a challenge, but overall I think we’ve made improvements in the areas that needed it.
We escaped spring ball with only a few minor injuries and nothing too significant, which is much better than we were last year. If Henry and his receivers can work together and develop a down field threat, if Bolden is 100% and his supporting cast takes shows up, and we execute the gameplan we should win some games.
Lot’s of ifs………….but I think we can be a pretty good football team this year.
BTFU
Dosvidaniya, bitches! BTFU!
Raw talent doesn't matter
If you don’t have a coach to run them in the right places and a QB to get them the ball.
Ever Grateful. Ever True.
Agreed
But like I stated there have been some significant changes made, and hopefully for the better.
Dosvidaniya, bitches! BTFU!
Still think Marve will be the starter at QB....
With Henry coming in for predictable running plays
Ever Grateful. Ever True.
No scar on either knee? Must be a transfer.
by Erik T on Apr 25, 2011 9:27 AM CDT up reply actions 4 recs
ha
Off Tackle Empire
The quintessential Big Ten smoking room.
by Graham Filler on Apr 25, 2011 9:45 AM CDT up reply actions
She appears to be in mid-clap.
I come from a land down unda
Is THAT what he's looking at?
Hey Darling, we’re a sciencey school. You can take something for that.
this will start to sound like a broken record, given time
A bowl game isn’t out of the question. A bowl game wouldn’t even surprise me. I would say that about every team in the conference save Indiana (sorry, Indiana) ((not really)). However, given the fact that some of these teams actually have to play each other, something’s got to give. I see Purdue as one of the teams to give.
Bowling: could, but won’t.
I think that's right
I can see the path to 6 wins. Score the first three non-con games. Beat Minnesota, Illinois or Iowa, and Indiana. But, 5-7 just seems about right for the Boilers.
Looking at schedules, Minnesota is the only team that I can’t plausibly find six wins for.
"Bama Hawkeye, you know, the Iowa blogger who actually uses reason and analysis." - Patrick Vint
http://www.offtackleempire.com
by Bama Hawkeye on Apr 25, 2011 9:16 AM CDT up reply actions
Not with that schedule
"Bama Hawkeye, you know, the Iowa blogger who actually uses reason and analysis." - Patrick Vint
http://www.offtackleempire.com
by Bama Hawkeye on Apr 25, 2011 1:15 PM CDT up reply actions
omg
We need to start setting odds!
Off Tackle Empire
The quintessential Big Ten smoking room.
by Graham Filler on Apr 25, 2011 9:13 AM CDT up reply actions
2 to 1 he gets hopped up on bourbon and guarantees it…
“MarQueis Gray is, IMO, better than Cam Newton!”
Off Tackle Empire
The quintessential Big Ten smoking room.
by Graham Filler on Apr 25, 2011 9:14 AM CDT up reply actions
Poor guy looked half-decent in three different systems
Unfortunately this did not mean he looked 150% decent in any one season.
Brewster really screwed Weber over
With the offense du jour philosophy
"Lord I pray for the eyes of an eagle, the heart of a lion and the balls of a combat helicopter pilot."
Wait...
there was an offensive philosophy? Seriously?
Editor at BT Powerhouse, a Big Ten Basketball blog.
Author at Acme Packing Company, a Green Bay Packers blog
by OBrienSchofieldismyHero on Apr 25, 2011 4:12 PM CDT up reply actions
I'm pretty sure one of them was
Kill Adam Weber. AND Eric Decker.
Editor at BT Powerhouse, a Big Ten Basketball blog.
Author at Acme Packing Company, a Green Bay Packers blog
by OBrienSchofieldismyHero on Apr 25, 2011 4:33 PM CDT up reply actions 1 recs
Until Decker kept getting laid out...
…that was affectionately known among Gopher fans as the “8 to 7 for 6” offensive philosophy. And had Decker been a complete cyborg instead of a nearly superhuman hybrid it would have worked.
In later years, the “Kill Weber” portion of the gameplan was replaced with “Turn Weber into a shortstop instead of a QB” philosophy. Seriously, Jedd Fisch had him throw baseballs to tweak his throwing motion.
I think Purdue needs to have five wins by Halloween if they want to go bowling.
Because the end of that schedule looks potentially treacherous. @MICH, @WIS, Ohio State look tough and Iowa should be a tricky game for them, too.
Winning five games before 10/31 is certainly feasible, though. The first three games should be wins, which means they just need to go .500 against ND, Minny, @PSU, and Illinois. That’s doable.
"I want to be a cowboy. I don't want to be a panda. Pandas are boring, stupid and boring. Bad panda!"
absolutely...
Except they have run into so many problems late season of late.
BTW. Question for Purdue fans: I found lots of complaints about the Purdue Defense last year. These included complaints about the coverage schemes. So. What kind of coverage scheme does Purdue run? Does it suck? How will it improve?
Off Tackle Empire
The quintessential Big Ten smoking room.
by Graham Filler on Apr 25, 2011 10:01 AM CDT up reply actions
Linebackers are often out of position and unable to shed blocks. That is the most common complaint. That leads to safety Logan Link leading the team in tackles last year.
As for coverage schemes….I’m not well versed in X’s and O’s but it seems we always go to a soft cover 2 or cover 3 if Purdue has a lead in the 4th quarter.
Ever Grateful. Ever True.
Basic 4-3 setup
Usually cover 2. Its not necessarily the scheme, its the read or lack thereof by the secondary.
Deep threats have been covered pretty well. Run stopping has been much better as of late, but if you want to complete a first down all you need to do is run a slant across the middle and you’re sure to complete a 5-10 yarder every time. The LB’s don’t pull back from the line in time and the Safety’s usually are out of position. Its not a skill problem, its a coaching problem and has been for a while.
Dosvidaniya, bitches! BTFU!
I may be in the minority of Northwestern fans for this
but I’m glad Purdue is no longer a locked game. Since football began, Northwestern has more losses to Purdue than any other team. The Boilermakes seem to eke out wins more often than they should.
Wait a minute, NW has more losses to OSU than any other B1G team, so --- OHHHH.
Well played, sir.
Thanks to the magic of schedule rotations, since 1995 NW has ten losses to Purdue, just ahead of the 9 losses to OSU and PSU and 8 to Michigan.
"I want to be a cowboy. I don't want to be a panda. Pandas are boring, stupid and boring. Bad panda!"
I think this is Hope's make or break year
Purdue had a lot riding on this coaching change, much like Wisconsin did with Alvarez-Bielema and Iowa with Fry-Ferentz. The first two guys were able to maintain the program at high levels, and if Hope doesn’t get it done this year, it might be tough for Purdue to get back to where they were under Joe TIller.
"Lord I pray for the eyes of an eagle, the heart of a lion and the balls of a combat helicopter pilot."
So that would be 4 Big Ten Seasons with a winning record out of 12 total under Tiller.
Lofty heights there to be sure.
Not sure there ever was a “high” level under Tiller. Getting back to middling might be an accomplishment.
Yes. You are correct. 3 of those 4 winning B1G Seasons were with Brees under center.
They were 22-10 in the Big Ten under Tiller with Brees. 36-30 without him.
So I guess, find the once in a generation quarterback (Griese, Brees) = 1 B1G title.
Don’t forget Mike Phipps!
Author at Off Tackle Empire
and Errant Pass Downfield
@RicardoEfendi
by Ricardo Efendi on Apr 25, 2011 2:18 PM CDT up reply actions
So all Purdue needs is another Drew Brees huh?
HELP IS ON THE WAY
http://www.insidetheshoe.com/
by SouthBayBuckeye on Apr 25, 2011 1:16 PM CDT up reply actions
What Tiller did at Purdue was significant
From 1985-1996, Purdue did not have a winning record, and in Tiller’s first season the Boilermakers went 9-3, going to a bowl game for the first time since 1984. Prior to Tiller’s arrival, Purdue had gone to five bowl games all time, and by the time he left Tiller doubled that number, going 4-6 overall.
He also took them to a Rose Bowl, and completely changed the way offense is played in the Big Ten. The guy’s legacy deserves a little bit more than to be called ‘middling’.
"Lord I pray for the eyes of an eagle, the heart of a lion and the balls of a combat helicopter pilot."
Yes. He made a signifigant impact on Purdue.
With their history before he arrived a winning season was an accomplishment.
Still, I’m not sure he revolutionized the way offense is played in the Big Ten. While a few teams have used some spread elements to achieve success (OSU on occasion, PSU) others have failed miserably in the Big Ten (UM under RR and MSU under JLS).
He used a once in a generation quarterback to have achieve a few very good seasons. When he didn’t have that transcendent QB his squads were average at best.
Ummmm...
…for about the one-millionth time (not blaming you MSULaxer27, but way too many fans have said this recently), Michigan’s offense was FINE under RichRod. Better than fine, actually. Last year, they were 25th nationally in points per game scored with 32.8. They moved the ball well, and were, pretty much, an ELITE offense (with the exception of Denard throwing a few too many picks….)
The problem was NOT the spread offense….but rather the sieve-like defense, which was 105th nationwide (yep, 15 from the bottom) at 35.2 ppg allowed.
RichRod’s obituary should not read “The Spread cannot work in the Big Ten”….because his spread offense DID work in the Big Ten. His obituary should read: “Focusing just on the offense and letting your defense catch the plague/leprosy is a recipe for disaster as a Big Ten coach.”
STOP RUINING HIS FACTS WITH YOUR LOGIC!
Editor at BT Powerhouse, a Big Ten Basketball blog.
Author at Acme Packing Company, a Green Bay Packers blog
by OBrienSchofieldismyHero on Apr 25, 2011 4:13 PM CDT up reply actions
I can accept that.
Would it be a true statement then to say that the teams that have been most successful in the B1G since 1997 have not run the spread?
OSU ran a spread-like offense with Smith and Pryor
and they’ve done ok. Add two other conference champs in Northwestern and Purdue with Penn State running “Spread HD” and most of the top teams have run a spread at some point.
It’s pretty much only Wisconsin, Iowa, and MSU that haven’t spent a significant amount of time as a spread-like offense.
Actually JL Smith ran the spread with Drew Stanton.
Maybe that is why I remember it as an unmitigated disaster?
We'll go to the grave disagreeing on this
But RichRod’s offenses failed quite spectacularly against the better defenses in the Big Ten, and this last year only piled up points after they were being blown out in those games (vs. Iowa and vs. Wisconsin).
Author at Off Tackle Empire
and Errant Pass Downfield
@RicardoEfendi
by Ricardo Efendi on Apr 25, 2011 2:21 PM CDT up reply actions
Agreed
It’s easy to score 40 against a weak noncon opponent, but when you can’t be consistently good against good defenses, RRod’s spread can’t be considered a success.
"Lord I pray for the eyes of an eagle, the heart of a lion and the balls of a combat helicopter pilot."
But...
…NO ONE scored against those defenses. Because those defenses were GOOD. Michigan scored as much/more than other opponents against the best defenses.
There’s plenty to hate on RichRod about….but the spread offense? Not one of those things.
3-3-5
what do you want on your tombstone, DickRod?
HELP IS ON THE WAY
http://www.insidetheshoe.com/
by SouthBayBuckeye on Apr 25, 2011 3:45 PM CDT up reply actions
Yes and no.
Wisconsin and Iowa both were much more bend-but-don’t-break than they were shut down squads this past season. That Ohio Sate was pretty much lights out, I will grant you.
Still, its begs the question: can you can be consistently good in the Big Ten while running what is primarily a spread offense? The answer is a resounding no. Even with top-flight offensive talent (like Denard Robinson), the rugged, downhill style of the Big Ten’s best defenses will kill the spread (in conference play). I wrote a long-winded analysis arguing this point on my site (SHAMELESS SELF-PROMOTION ALERT)- again, doubt it will convince you, but would love your feedback on it
Author at Off Tackle Empire
and Errant Pass Downfield
@RicardoEfendi
by Ricardo Efendi on Apr 25, 2011 3:47 PM CDT up reply actions
Obviously untrue
The answer is a resounding: “we haven’t seen it so far”. The sample size is not exactly large.
Your post is a bit ambiguous, so forgive me if my response doesn’t address what you hoped to raise (although I’m assuming you’re agreeing with me).
Per the sample size, I think we have a sizable enough one. Let’s start the discussion with 1998 when Tiller and co. popularized the basketball on grass offense. Since then we’ve had 23 claims to a league championship (owing to multiple instances of co-champs being crowned). Exactly two were spread-first offenses: 2000 Purdue (with a 6-2 conference record) and 2000 co-champ Northwestern (also with a 6-2 league mark). None of those teams repeated; hell, neither of them have really come close to getting back to the top of the conference.
On the other hand, the programs with multiple league titles (Wisconsin, Iowa, Michigan-pre RichRod, and mostly Ohio State) have featured more traditional run-first offenses. Ohio State has used athletic quarterbacks (Troy Smith, Tattooed Pryor), but they’re not in the shotgun with nearly the same frequency that Zac Kustok was.
Author at Off Tackle Empire
and Errant Pass Downfield
@RicardoEfendi
by Ricardo Efendi on Apr 25, 2011 4:14 PM CDT up reply actions
Looking at Purdue's offensive philosophy seems to be missing the (a) point
If the argument is that running the spread can (by itself) turn a crap Big Ten program into a powerhouse, yeah we can probably say that that’s not true. If the argument is that the spread cannot be a successful offense at a successful school (just as, say, off-tackle megabeef or whathaveyou) then I think the sample size is very much smaller.
I don’t mean to say that the spread is some kind of magical offense. I only think that it could work in the Big Ten as well as any other modern offense, relative to the reasonable expectation level at the institution in question.
Fair point.
Author at Off Tackle Empire
and Errant Pass Downfield
@RicardoEfendi
by Ricardo Efendi on Apr 25, 2011 4:48 PM CDT up reply actions
The fallacy here....
…is still sample-size, and that you’re only measuring by conference championships (which, quite obviously regardless of the scheme they run, will be dominated by the upper-tier conference teams).
Northwestern/Purdue being elevated to MORE than mere conference doormats (and arguably consistent bowl teams that win a higher than expected share of their games against top conference competition), given their respective talent deficits vis a vis the uppier-tier big Ten teams, is a sign enough of the spread’s effectiveness.
Actually, the bar is even lower — that these offenses succeed (and they have, even against the best defenses in the conference) is a sign that spread offenses do work….the problem is, the teams that employ them have talent deficiencies on defense that cannot be compensated for, even by the best spread offenses.
by Chadnudj on Apr 25, 2011 4:46 PM CDT up reply actions 1 recs
It doesn't work any better in the Big 12
Thanks, Sconnie, for foisting Kevin Cosgrove on us.
/weeps at the memory of losing to Colorado 65-51
by Albino Tornado on Apr 25, 2011 2:42 PM CDT up reply actions
Addition by subtraction
Also managed to get rid of Hankwitz and Doeren.
Author at Off Tackle Empire
and Errant Pass Downfield
@RicardoEfendi
by Ricardo Efendi on Apr 25, 2011 2:47 PM CDT up reply actions
Hey, next time, DON'T take the defensive coordinator from the 2000-2003 Wisconsin squads.
Most people know those weren’t very good.
Editor at BT Powerhouse, a Big Ten Basketball blog.
Author at Acme Packing Company, a Green Bay Packers blog
by OBrienSchofieldismyHero on Apr 25, 2011 4:26 PM CDT up reply actions
I'm a dedicated Wisconsin fan
I’d be committing treason by talking to Tim Brewster. I think the quality of defenses Wisconsin fielded from 2000 to 2003 (better known as, BAD to AWFUL) would be a tip-off. I mean, Minnesota’s only wins against the Badgers in this decade came in that four year run…
Editor at BT Powerhouse, a Big Ten Basketball blog.
Author at Acme Packing Company, a Green Bay Packers blog
by OBrienSchofieldismyHero on Apr 25, 2011 4:57 PM CDT up reply actions
Much as I hate to stick up for that moustachioed misanthrope, Tiller’s first season, in which he went 9-3, was with the immortal Billy Dicken at the helm, with Brees playing sparingly as a backup. It’s a bit misleading to include the 1997 season on Brees’s tally.
The Crimson Quarry, SB Nation's Indiana Hoosiers blog
by John M (The Crimson Quarry) on Apr 25, 2011 1:12 PM CDT up reply actions
The mighty Brees falls back to 16-8...
and is responsible for only two of Tiller’s four winning B1G seasons.
I count 5, and several good years with 4-4 conference records
From 1997 – 2006 he was 48-32 in the Big Ten. At Purdue that is a significant accomplishment, especially given Purdue’s struggles in the previous 15 or so years.
During that same period of time MSU was 33-47 and had 2 winning conference records, so I thought you would have a greater appreciation for what Tiller did. Or maybe you are still bitter because of all the close losses MSU had to Tiller over the years. 2002 was a sweet one that comes to mind.
Ever Grateful. Ever True.
I am partial to the 1997 comeback win over Sparty...
http://enginerdknows.blogspot.com
by Docjay00 on Apr 25, 2011 12:57 PM CDT up reply actions 1 recs
So I guess we'll forget about Tiller's last two seasons.
This isn’t about me or MSU’s well documented struggles from the 2000 thru 2006 football seasons. I’m sure this period will be pointed out ad infinitum when we get to MSU week in about two months from now.
I know you guys pride yourselves on your astronauts and science/engineering programs so surely you are familiar with the term anomaly?
The best coach in Purdue’s football history (it’s a toss up between Tiller and Mollenkopf. Both won a single shared B1G title. Molly won his Rose. Tiller didn’t) had a great run against two of the worst coaches in MSU’s history (It’s a toss up between BWill and Muddy Waters for the worst. Bobby won a bowl game. Muddy couldn’t get near one).
I have written about this in other places but, 2000-2010 was the worst decade of MSU football since the 20’s. So congratulations on Tiller’s success against MSU. Success against MSU during this period in our history is much like claiming to be the valedictorian of the special ed class or the tallest midget.
If you consider 4-4 a “good” season then you are correct, Tiller was an unparalleled success.
Winning a conference championship of any form (shared or outright) at Purdue....
Is a huge success. A school like Purdue will never be able to constantly reload and go 6-2 every year. So if that’s how you define success then that is unrealistic IMO.
Ever Grateful. Ever True.
So if Hope can get you to 4-4 in conference and lower tier bowl then...
you guys will be happy?
Ok. Now I understand a little better.
Are you happy about
Going to a national upper level bowl and getting embarrassed by a top tier SEC team? Don’t act like MSU goes to upper tier bowl games all the time……..
Just because MSU is on an upswing of success as of late doesn’t mean you are head and shoulders above Purdue or any other school. MSU is a middle of the road B10 program just like Purdue is, and over the last few years MSU has had much more success than we have. That is all, nothing more. If we go to a lower tier bowl game your damn right that will make us happy.
Dosvidaniya, bitches! BTFU!
Again. If MSU is in the middle to top half of the B1G standings...
It is a return to where we once were.
Purdue has a losing record all-time against the B1G and a winning record against only Indiana, Northwestern and Iowa.
MSU has a winning record all-time against the B1G and a losing record against only UM, PSU, OSU and inexplicably Iowa.
6-4 is substantially different that 3-7, no?
Agreed, MSU has a better overall record
But it’s marginal and not quite as simply put.
MSU overall winning percentage is (.541).
Purdue overall winning percentage (.502).
Dosvidaniya, bitches! BTFU!
I was referring to records against conference teams.
There MSU is 16 games over .500 and Purdue is 14 games under .500.
Of course this counts for MSU all games against conference teams and not just games in conference.
Our conference record is probably a little bit better if you don’t include all the games we played against UM when we had 1500 students total.
For this exercise we can.
Those percentages I posted were in conference
MSU is higher, yes but its closer than you infer it is. And I’m sure I can put an asterisk on our record to of some sort
Dosvidaniya, bitches! BTFU!
According to this:
http://www.cfbdatawarehouse.com/data/div_ia/bigten/purdue/vs_conf.php
Purdue’s record against the conference is 321-335-33. I’m sure you played UM and OSU a few times when they weren’t conference members. As well as us and PSU. (Quick check – about 10 times).
MSU’s record against the conference is 260-244-15.
On the other hand we played all the schools besides Iowa and Illinois at least once before we joined the conference in 1953. Some such as Purdue and Indiana a few times.
Some, such as UM 45 times. Going 9-33-3 in those games might skew our true “in-conference” record.
Yes, a bowl appearance would be a step in the right direction.
I can’t speak for all Purdue fans, but I expect to contend for the conference championship once every few years and not be god awful in the years in between. So basically what Tiller did from 1997 to 2003. Purdue will never be able to reload every year like the blue bloods do for obvious reasons and neither will MSU.
Ever Grateful. Ever True.
You could have ended your post without the dig at MSU.
What are the obvious reasons that Purdue can’t reload every year? fND recruits nationally. Indiana is one the the few programs in the B1G more historically inept than yours. You should be able to clean up the instate talent.
I am interested to see what MSU can accomplish in the modern era when our Head Coach, AD, President and Board of Trustees are all on the same page and not fighting for power. It’s our hope that we return to the national success we achieved in our past.
MSU can return to success as you speak
If your Coach keeps allowing half your team to play with house arrest ankle bracelets on as he has done in the past. What does it take to get suspended from the team at MSU? Murder in the 1st?
Dosvidaniya, bitches! BTFU!
by BoilerUpAT on Apr 25, 2011 1:58 PM CDT up reply actions 2 recs
We've had a few players both suspended and dismissed from the team.
Both for games and forever.
I do wish Dantonio would take a harder line with the players, but he did learn under Tressel. Hopefully, the shitstorm Tressel created with the Tat5 has put the fear of god in him.
I like Dantonio
And think he’s a really good football coach. But he does need to get this aspect of his program revised, this isn’t the Big East.
Dosvidaniya, bitches! BTFU!
What are the obvious reasons that Purdue can’t reload every year?
The economics of college athletics…..Purdue can only sell 62,500 tickets to each home game whereas Ohio State, Michigan, and Penn State can sell 100,000+. That is a big difference in revenue. You need revenue to pay coaches competitively and pay for recruiting expenses. There’s also the fact that Indiana produces far less Big Ten talent than other states and isn’t the only major conference football program in the state.
Ever Grateful. Ever True.
Did OTE pay Laxer...
…to rile up the Purdue natives and get the comment thread flowing? Because he’s doing a bang-up job right now…
Nope. This is gratis.
A dislike of Purdue basketball bled over into all things Purdue athletically.
I wish that when they were assigning rivals we had gotten Purdue instead of IU, but then I guess we have to give the Hoosiers a chance to take back their spitter from time to time.
Then again if you follow EDSBS…I’m really arguing with myself.
Interesting that you feel that way....
because I have nothing but respect and admiration for Izzo and the MSU basketball program. They are the only other Big Ten program that I like to see do well, while being mostly indifferent to all others. I also enjoyed my visit to East Lansing for the Purdue basketball game this year, the folks were nice.
Ever Grateful. Ever True.
Agreed.
I’ve always enjoyed both football and basketball games at MSU. Always had a great time and their fans are fiery, yet below obnoxious level.
Comparing talent levels, MSU should always blow Purdue out of the water. Wasting talent is an MSU tradition, though Dantonio has the team on the up and up. We’ll see how it goes.
As for bragging about MSU being better than Purdue in football – if that’s the measuring stick for success… then, well, umm, I’m lost for words.
http://enginerdknows.blogspot.com
I didn't start it and I feel like I'm in a cripple fight when I explain why MSU is better than Purdue in football.
My comments were in response PurdueMatt when he posted about how much “better” Purdue was during a very small historic window.
I never said Purdue was a better football program than MSU...
MSU’s national championships end that debate pretty quickly. I was responding to your assertion that the Tiller era was middling and underwhelming which couldn’t be further from the truth. His Big Ten record from 1997-2006 illustrates that pretty well, especially compared to another mid tier Big Ten program in MSU. Not to mention the Rose Bowl berth, influence on the conference by bringing the basketball on grass spread, and becoming Purdue’s winningest coach.
Ever Grateful. Ever True.
Always found Purdue fans individually quite nice.
Enjoyed working with Purdue alums in NYC as well.
Something a while back about Purdue rubbed me the wrong way and it just stuck, festered and grew.
OMG, just reading about Purdue makes my blood boil! I just want to break things!
I can’t wait until November 19th when we will absolutely CRUSH Our Most Hated Rival!
by HawkeyeRecon on Apr 25, 2011 3:39 PM CDT reply actions 3 recs
Fret not, there is plenty of Iowa for everyone to hate.
"GO HAWKS!" - only cure for Hawkeye Envy
by BentNotBroken on Apr 25, 2011 7:51 PM CDT up reply actions
Did you get that from the Sconnie site?
They have one of those t-shirts for every Big Ten state not called Wisconsin.
Author at Off Tackle Empire
and Errant Pass Downfield
@RicardoEfendi
by Ricardo Efendi on Apr 25, 2011 4:15 PM CDT up reply actions
That seems like odd overkill.
I mean, what does Wisky have against inoffensive, flat little Indiana?
Dude
have you ever had to drive through Indiana? It’s almost as boring as driving through Iowa. Or the parts of Wisconsin not hemmed in by I-90 and I-94. Or all of western Minnesota.
Author at Off Tackle Empire
and Errant Pass Downfield
@RicardoEfendi
by Ricardo Efendi on Apr 25, 2011 4:27 PM CDT up reply actions
Boring yes...
…but don’t insult Indiana like that. The whole state doesn’t reek of pig feces like Iowa does.
Smells like money
"GO HAWKS!" - only cure for Hawkeye Envy
by BentNotBroken on Apr 25, 2011 7:45 PM CDT up reply actions
You have clearly never been through Kansas
or Nebraska. Nothing makes you think Iowa or Indiana are “scenic” like those barren hellscapes
It never gets to be easy.
Why the fuck doesn't it ever get to be easy?
by chitownhawkeye on Apr 26, 2011 9:38 PM CDT up reply actions
63-32.
There was a REASON we killed them 83-20.
Editor at BT Powerhouse, a Big Ten Basketball blog.
Author at Acme Packing Company, a Green Bay Packers blog
by OBrienSchofieldismyHero on Apr 25, 2011 4:28 PM CDT up reply actions
Ugh.
That 2001 team killed me. They had far more felony charges than they did conference wins.
Author at Off Tackle Empire
and Errant Pass Downfield
@RicardoEfendi
by Ricardo Efendi on Apr 25, 2011 4:30 PM CDT up reply actions
I'm pretty sure the only major violation in recent Wisconsin history happened that season.
As in “major violation”, because the NCAA royally fucked the shoe situation up.
Editor at BT Powerhouse, a Big Ten Basketball blog.
Author at Acme Packing Company, a Green Bay Packers blog
by OBrienSchofieldismyHero on Apr 25, 2011 4:37 PM CDT up reply actions
That was the 2000 season.
We were overrated anyways. Bollinger’s option/bootleg game complemented Dayne the same way Samuel did. Bollinger and Bennett? Not so much.
Author at Off Tackle Empire
and Errant Pass Downfield
@RicardoEfendi
by Ricardo Efendi on Apr 25, 2011 4:50 PM CDT up reply actions
Well...
we DID get 1,598 yards out of Michael Bennett that year…and 1,466 from Anthony “Won’t Play Against Iowa” Davis…
Editor at BT Powerhouse, a Big Ten Basketball blog.
Author at Acme Packing Company, a Green Bay Packers blog
by OBrienSchofieldismyHero on Apr 25, 2011 4:51 PM CDT up reply actions
great effort!
But, unfortunately not all photoshops are equal.
"GO HAWKS!" - only cure for Hawkeye Envy
by BentNotBroken on Apr 25, 2011 7:49 PM CDT up reply actions
Thanks
I’d be much better if I could do it in Microstation with a freeway running through it, but I digress.
http://enginerdknows.blogspot.com
by Docjay00 on Apr 25, 2011 8:33 PM CDT via mobile up reply actions
Of course you must be in a train station?
"GO HAWKS!" - only cure for Hawkeye Envy
by BentNotBroken on Apr 25, 2011 9:05 PM CDT up reply actions
Outlook for Purdue? At least we have hoops
I have no faith in Danny Hope to keep us above water and relevant in a Big Ten that, with the Nebraska addition, just got significantly more competitive. Hope just strikes me as an idiot and I can’t see him developing a gameplan to level the playing field, as Tiller did so well (until the Curtis Painter era). Anyone remember when he was referencing players needing to “eat their veggies” when discussing the injuries? It was an absolute joke, though arguably not at as bad as his home losses to Northern Illinois and Toledo.
The only way for Purdue to succeed in this conference is to bring in a rogue (Mike Leach anyone?) and re-brand themselves as a gimmicky team. Ironically I began to hate that in the Tiller era but we’ll never be able to recruit the athletes that Ohio State, Michigan, Penn State, or even Wisconsin and Iowa are able to. Indiana is a terrible football state and we’re surrounded by bigger-name programs. I do like how Hope has brought in kids from Florida, like Tiller did from Texas, but I don’t see him being creative enough to find ways to use them that other schools wouldn’t.
All that said, Hope had better win at least 7 games this season because the schedule is about to get really, really hard in the coming years. I’m sort of optimistic about this team taking us bowling, but don’t get used to it Boiler fans. Danny Hope isn’t the man for the (challenging) job at Purdue.
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